Im of mixed heritage, Guyanese and Native American. But I grew up identifying closely with African American/Black girls in terms of my behavior and outlook. Though due to the community in which I grew up most friends I had in my neighborhood as a youngsters were either Indian or Pakistanian.
I did have two African American friends, Hajar, who I wrote about before and then Maleekah. Hajar and Maleekah were both born Muslim and have Muslim families and were good Muslim girls. Although, unfornately many (not all!) of the Pakistanian and Indian sisters who I grew up with and who I love for the sake of Allah, have gone on to become "cultural" Muslims. My definition of a cultural Muslim is someone who was born and raised in a practicing Muslim home but grew up to become either very laxed in their application of Islam or completely non practicing. The only real claim most cultural Muslims have is to the "culture" of Islam that they may still fondly cherish. And may Allah guide them and us all.
But that's not what I am wanted to write about. What I wanted to write about is Muslim women of color, specifically us brown and black Musleemat and the type of men we choose for marriage. My two African American friends have both as I said been wonderful friends to me. I talk to them both atleast twice a month, (which is a lot considering how expensive it is to call the States from here). The thing is that both are divorced. Hajar has been divorced many times and has a couple of children from those marriages and Maleekah just recently went through her first divorce after waiting many years to wed and is expecting her first baby all by herself. While myself and all my Indian and Pakistanian friends , some of who have less zeal (not all!) for Islam than either Hajar or Maleekah, have been married for many years and have seemingly happy and solid relationships with their husbands.
What could be the problem? That's what I spent 56 minutes talking with Maleekah about a couple of days ago. Now, she thought my conclusions were very controversial so if today you're feeling a bit sensitive now would be the best time to exit my blog. For the rest of you hanging strong, these are my opinions based on my own observations. If you differ, which I expect some will, feel free to leave a comment.
Hajar and Maleeka both have only been married to African American men, mostly reverts to Islam. My other friends all married to either raised Muslims who are Arabs (as I am), white Americans or Asian Muslim men. I'll be blunt from here on out. The problem that I see many religious Muslim sisters of color have with marriage or staying married is that they chose the wrong men to marry from the beginning. And to be even more blunt, religious Muslim women of color have the hardest of times with African American and Latino brothers. Yeah, I know it hurts to put it out there like that, but it needs to be said. Don't take it the wrong way. It's not meant to be a put down of western minority Muslim men. I will actually be the first to say that Alhamdulilah there are some wonderful Black and Latino Muslim men out there in the world who are great, loving, hard working family men who are productive members of their Muslim communities. Though they are an endangered group. Inshallah I am hoping they can make a fierce come back because they're needed, though right now every time a sister of color tells me that she is going through it in her marriage it's at the hands of a Black or Latino Muslim man.From lying to laziness to cheating/polygyny to extreme poverty to physical and mental abuse to insert whatever problem you want black/brown Muslim women are at the top of the list enduring it. That's a problem and we really need to change that.
What I know to be a good remedy to this problem is for our sisters to make better husband selections. Know the type of men who you need to steer clear of and choose the opposite. To do this you dont have to x off brothers of those beautiful darker hues that many of you prefer. Allah has made all types of Muslim men and the best thing is that we are blessed in that Islam is found every where on this earth. Black and brown Muslim women are really not disadvantaged as many would have us fooled to believe. There's the whole continent of Africa where Allah has put some of the most beautiful Muslim men of color in the world at in places like Nigeria, Ghana, Ethiopia, Egypt, Morroco, Somalia, Sudan and Eriteria and it's an added plus with our North African brothers because they are Arabic speakers. There are also really beautiful brown Muslim men in South east Asia in countries such as Indonesia, Brunei, Malaysia and the Phillippines just to name a few and what I love about South east Asia is that you find many of our brothers there are well versed in the Qur'an. For those sisters who are not hung up on color there are an increasing number of White American and European brothers out there single, looking and open to interracial marriage with brown and black women. Our middle eastern brothers are also a wonderful option and it seems that Musleemat of color are least likely to consider marrying this way for a number of reasons but mostly sisters tell me that they feel that our Arab brothers are only interested in our White western sisters. That could be the farthest from the truth. If you're single and know of a good single Arab brother in your community, go ahead and enquire about him. Insha'Allah, you'd be surprise how many Arabs would prefer women of color. I would suggest marrying our brothers from Yemen, but I'm biased lol. If you can snag a Saudi, Allahu Akbar, even better. It's not impossible. I actually do know of two African American sisters who are married to Saudis and they have beautiful stable, long term marriages.
I can't say I know the reason why marriages amongst western minority Muslims are doing so poorly. Allahu Alim. We may never know. What's apparent is that black and brown sisters need good husbands. Babies are being made and these Muslim children need and have to be raised upon Islam in healthy and loving environments with strong Muslim male role models. And I know someone is thinking it, but it should already be known that the first qualities that any Muslim woman looking to wed must put foremost importance on is the religion and character of any prospects she has. I dont want anyone to leave a comment and say, "who cares about race, deen is most important anyway." Good, strong deen is the most important asset a man can have. There, I said it for you and more importantly I believe it. Now, let's move on because in order to get your the rent or house paid and to have a harmonious marriage brothers need to be well rounded in all areas of life and not just in his pursuit of deeni knowldge.Other things sisters can do besides not choosing men that statistically don't do well in marriages is to look into his traits. Let's face it bad husbands can and are found in all races, the percentages are just a little different. What to do now? Look at his family and upbringing. Are his parents alive? If so, are they still married? Or was he raised in a single headed family? Did he grow up around domestic violence? How many of his siblings (especially brothers) are in good, strong marriages? How many of his siblings are divorced? Is he previously married? If so, how many times? How many sexual partners has he had (before and after Islam, if he is a revert)?
Do you get the picture? You have to dig deep and be vigilant about finding a match for your own values as a Muslim wife. You have to know already that you deserve good and will not accept less than, half way or left overs. It does require hard work on your part and the part of those assisting you Inshallah to marry a good Muslim man. But You can find him and he can be a great Muslim husband inshallah. You can! Believe that. Trust in that Allah does provide and that whatever you want and desire Allah can give it to you in this life as well as in the hereafter. You can acheive it, inshallah.
26 comments:
Great article, something to reflect on as a Latina. Inshallah I pray you will continue to your pen to paper and share your thoughts on life and islam. Your sister, Khadijah Rivera.
Assalaamu 'Alaykum,
I am a Desi sister who was once married to an AA brother and sadly my marriage has ended as well. I remember once talking to an older Pakistani sister and when she learned that my husband at the time was AA she quietly asked me if he treated me well because she knows several Moroccan sisters married to AA brothers and they treat their wives like crap. I lied and told her "He treats me like a Queen" only because I hate to feed into negative stereotypes especially when it comes to Desis and AAs. Two years later when my marriage ended and I ended the facade, she hugged me and wept with me. It’s very heartbreaking to see these marriages end ESPECIALLY when children are involved but I make sure my Ex takes care of his kids financially through child support unlike many sisters who feel it may be un-Islamic to do so and then rush into another marriage so that they can have another man to take care of her and her kids. I pray for us all…
As an AA muslim, I have been married for over 13 years. I always ask my wife about her happiness. Sometimes, I cannot believe how happy she is considering I want so much more for her and our family.
Being a California guy, I have witnessed numerous marriages between people from different cultures. I must say that the AA marriages that I have witnessed are very strong. On the other hand, desi and arab based marriages usually entail a lot of cultural silence. If we look at these marriages, they usually have more economic stability but the women suffer in silence. The culture of the "old country" is very prevalent.
I will admit that many AA women choose men based upon very artificial and temporal factors that have nothing to do with character and sincerity.
As AA women get burned by these men with these lacking character, they choose men later in life with better character and values. Unfortunately, AA women are no longer in their prime when realizing what is important in relationships.
I think the solution has to be more involvement from the African American family and church or masjid. Because many of these women are disconnected from their brothers, fathers, uncles and other mature male siblings there is no male gatekeeper to assist them in their choice of men. Many christian men will be suitable mates for AA muslim women.
Salam
My wife by the way is AfricanAmerican.
I came here via Tariq Nelson's blog. I have to say this was a great post. There are a lot of things to consider.
I think there is often a rush to get married when more time should be taken. This rush can cause you to pick people who you probably shouldnt.
I know one Desi lady who married a AA brother without checking into him, she was in a hurry. Now things are slowly starting to come out, questions about his background, his dedication to the deen, lies he has told, and him now starting to want money from his wife.
I am a white convert. When it came time to get married I took my time and was lucky, Alhamdulillah, that it did not take long to find a good woman. I looked for about six months and ended up getting married to a wonderful Saudi lady.
However, I had prepared myself to wait much longer. Even now I think how naive I was at the time. I didnt really know any of the pitfalls out there, people marrying for money, greencards, and the like.
Take your time. I realise that being married is completing the Sunnah and it is said it is half the deen, but if you rush to marry and get divorced, maybe even with children, then how have you completed your deen?
ASA Sister-
I too found your post by way of tariq nelson's blog and this struck too close to home to me being an AA muslim born and raised and married to an AA man. I come from an intact family, my parents have been married for 30 years and still going strong. I know several other AA families where that is the same case. However, I would be lying to act as if I had no clue as to what you were talking about. However, I think there are several factors that you have not included in your entry.
#1- AA sisters are more likely to seek a divorce over some other ethnicities that you mentioned. It is not as "taboo" in our community for a sister to decide to divorce a brother because "he's not acting right".
#2 AA Brothers (as a group) are more likely to grant their wife a divorce over other ethnicities) because the stigma of "You can't control your wife!" or "You're going to let your wife divorce you?" is not in our community.
#3 I believe the imams in our community are more open to and readily grant women divorces more in our community than others.
#4 Never underestimate the impact of racism in this issue. We are all one ummah, yes, that is all well and good but there are external factors, especially for our AA men living in America that a person of another ethnicity could never understand.
#5 Fact-Black men make far less than their White/Asian counterparts. How is he supposed to solely support a family? Some can and do (my dad and hubby)but they are not the majority. Many AA families have money issues that Muslim families from other countries-especially those who come over here from privilege could never understand. It is well documented that money issues is one of the number one reasons for divorce here in America.
#6 I could go on and on about the GLOBAL institution of racism in this world, but I won't. But I would bet (and I'm not a gambling woman) that any culture you go into not only are the browner people ALWAYS the poorer people. But, there is a higher rate of divorce, abuse, rape, theft, etc. that comes along with poverty.
#7 Lastly, I just wanted to take exception with your statement about your two friends who were lucky enough to marry Saudis. I have several stories of my own about sisters who were treated like crap and one almost beat to death by a Saudi who happened to frequent prostitutes as well. That however does not mean that there are not Saudi brothers out there who would make excellent Muslim husbands. It does mean, that just because you are from "Saudi" that does not make you the be all end all as a Muslim!
With that I am going to shutup now. I get a little long-winded on the subject because I love my community so much and if they only understood what was being done to them on a regular basis they (and all people of color) would be able to stop the cycle of Global racism that persists throughout the world now and truly live as the Prophet (saw) asked us to live in his last speech.
And this was not meant to be a rant on your reflective piece, but rather a guide for others to understand what is behind the phenomenon that you speak of!
ASA
Anon #1,Thank you for replying. This wasn't a post about brothers like you or sisters like your wife. There are a lot of strong AA couples although usually, these couples are older though. It the younger brothers and sisters, especially the reverts, who tend to have too much emotional baggage to maintain harmonious marriages.
Abo Sinan, good points. Although, It's not always stranger marriages. I know some stranger marriages that have faired very well. I'm not suggesting sisters or brothers to marry strange though. My point is about the type of men sisters are selecting. Whether they know them 20 years or not, if the brother has a history of divorce, abuse, neglect etc. He isn't someone a sister should take a chance on.
Mommamu, you brought up some excellent points. I agree with all of them. I didn't touch on those points because the post was mainly about selection. Those other factors are in my opinion attributing factors to bad selection. Sisters first must resolve to marrying a good brother. If he is some who has a history of divorce, no means to provide, and struggles with self image he isnt the type of brother that a religious Muslim needs to consider. He isn't the type of man that statistically is going to make a good husband or father.
As a brown Muslim woman I understand completely the dynamics in our communities. That isn't a reason for us continue the cycle. We, Musleemat, of color actually who are inshallah holding fast to the deen of Allah are in a position to make postive changes for our future generations. It all starts with good selection of spouses.
My comment on Saudi, I think was misunderstood. The takbir was about the location. As muhajira, I still would love to make to Saudi one day Inshallah. And I know other sisters want to get there as well. Marrying a Saudi is good strategic way for sisters to make that a reality. Of course, there are bad Saudi husbands. There bad husbands of every ethnicity. I hope I made that clear within my blog. Again, my only point was make good selection. If he is a good man, with good deen and character Muslims of color have the ability to marry him. Inshallah.
I have to agree with every single point mommamu made. To be quite honest with you sister, I am VERY offended by the things you are saying. (And I am not a sensitive person). I feel as though African-American and Latino brothers get a bad rap. Any misbehavior on their part is taken as a reflection of the entire group. People are so quick to jump up and say "oh, those African-American brothers are no good". Yet, when Arab, African or Indian brothers do the same thing it's somehow different. I have friends who are or have been married to Arab, Indian or African brothers who have been abused, neglected and abandonded. Some of them are/were the sole providers in the household and those brothers are not working (or barely working). Yet no one is saying Arab, Indian or African brothers suffer from some sort of pathology. (And I feel like that's what you're suggesting). As mommamu stated, those brothers are essentially able to keep their wrong doings on the low while African-American (and Latino) brothers are publicly demonized.
The other thing is a good number of those brothers (African, Indian, Arab etc) are looking for a green card. I've seen so many American sisters burned by those brothers. Some of them have left the sisters with babies to raise on their own. So it's not all bliss on the other side. And no, I'm not suggesting that all immigrant brothers are like this.
I feel like some sisters get it in their head that brothers from other countries will be better husbands by virtue of their ethnicity or country of origin and this is simply not true. (And I feel like that is what you're suggesting). There are snakes in every culture. I know Arab, Indian and African sisters who are going through hell with brothers from their countries but as mommamu said, because of the stigma surrounding divorce the sisters will stay in the marriage and take the abuse. (And let's not forget the shame based nature of many Muslim immigrant cultures which can prevent outsiders from knowing what bad things are taking place in the community since no one is willing to talk about what is happening). So you have women in horrible circumstances who will pretend everything is fine. Menawhile, the illusion remains and people go on to think only AA (and Latino) brothers are the monsters.
No man, mi nah support dat.
Anyhow, I've said enough.
Jamerican-Muslimah, yes there are bad apples in every race. I said that in the blog. I also pointed out in the blog that there are great, hard working AA and Latino Muslim men who are reliable family men. I've been Muslim all of my life. I'm not making any blanket statements. And I dont think I am being biased with my observations. Muslim women of color are having a harder time in marriages today. Muslim women of color are much more likely to have unhappy marriages when they are married to AA and Latino Muslim men and they divorced more often. Yes, other cultures do frown upon divorce and yes some of our Arab/Asian sisters endure horrendous abuse in silence but it's no where equal to amount of injustices that are epidemic amongst the western minority Muslims. And on top of that, I was comparing my own generation. None of my Indo/Pakistanian or Arab friends were force to wed. They married the men they liked just like my AA friends. The difference is that my AA friends' marriages have not lasted even half as long as the other group.
This is what I've witnessed all of my life. I dont even blame the brothers. Like Mommamu stated many of our brothers have a myriad of complications that they are dealing with. Most of the time the brothers are very honest with their limitations and sisters still marry them. What I've pointing out in that blog is that we sisters are the ones who have the ability inshallah to change the course of marriages by choosing good Muslim men. Period. If you are attracted to bad AA or Latino Muslim men, you will most likley be attracted to bad Arab, African or Asian men as well because it's not the men, its the sisters who need to change whats in themselves as Allah says.
My blog was not a put down to AA or Latino Muslim men. I understand the dynamics in our communities. I also have had experience to see the other pastures as well. Both sides have their work. But, truth be told, right now in most communities back in the states the pickings from the good AA and Latino brothers are slim to zero. Many of the good ones are already married. Sisters of color chances of selecting a good, pious husband and have a harmonious marriage are better with brothers from other ethnicities.
The points of the above poster and of Mommamu should have been noted within the original blog-post. I know the situation in the US is quote different from us in the UK for example but there does seem to be this constant blame on black brothers in the West. The amount of rash and naive Muslim bloggers that are peddling these sentiments against the black brothers of the West are so abundant that one has almost lost count of the amount of times these views emerge.
As for blindly singing the praises of the Arabs, Indians and Pakistanis then this is nothing but naivete. I am rather surprised that one can seem to discount:
1. Forced marriages
2. Honour killings - wherein wives can be openly slaughtered in front of the community - with the tacit approval of the community in many cases
3. Sexual and physical abuse within marriage
4. Adultery
5. Lack of zeal to implement Islamic correctly.
6. Control freakery
7. Mere using of sisters due to economic and social interests by desperately wanting to reside in the UK or US.
8. Sexual perversion
9. Biased and fanatical adherence to culture.
10. Domestic violence
...and a whole host of other ingredients that can be found within many Arab, Pakistani and Indian 'marriages' which some sisters have come to believe are the peak of spousal bliss! Indeed, the above points make "lying to laziness to polygamy to extreme poverty..." seem rather light in comparison. So for the sister to say that "...our Middle Eastern brothers are also a wonderful option" seems naive to say the least. as it is well known that they do not really go for black women and I am not including north-Africans in this, but the "Middle Eastern" who were alluded to in the post.
However, I do accept that the sister did emphasise that the sisters have to much mor eprudent in their selection of a husband and not be merely on a rash hype thing wherein a personality brother or a false claimant to righteousness and deen is chosen.
AbdulHaq al-Ashanti
www.salafimanhaj.com
To clarify once again Muslims, this blog was not to put down or to play up on any group of Muslim men. What this blog was about was sisters of color selecting better husbands. Period.
Brother Abdul Haq, I'm not naieve. I've been a black Muslim woman all of my life and I lived in various Muslim communities in the States. What I have relayed about my friends circumstances many, many, many AA and other Muslim women of color have gone through as well. These sisters like my friends are good sisters who ardently desire to be good wives inshallah. There problem is that are selecting the wrong type of brothers to marry. I dont know what else I can say to explain that.
And yes the other half of the problems these sisters have is that a large portion of AA and Latino brothers who revert to Islam have very jaded backgrounds that greatly diminish they're ability to be good husbands let alone good fathers. Would any of you like to discredit this as well?
So what to do? Pretend that sisters are not distressed and oppressed? My suggestion for sisters to look to marry brothers of other ethnicities does not negate the fact that of course every nationality of Muslims experience abusive. I mentioned that in my blog. But to be fair, it's no where comparable to what the AA and Latino Muslim communities are experiencing. Matter of fact, numbers 3-10 are all things that AA and Latino Muslim also have issues with as well.
I'll say it again for those who need to read it, I've seen both sides of the pastures and I know that bad Muslim men and women exists on ALL sides.
That's not what this blog is about. This blog is about the good Muslim women of color broadening their pool of choices but be open to good, practicing Muslim men from other ethnicities such as our Asian, Arab and Indo/Pakistaninian brothers.
as it is well known that they do not really go for black women
Well known to whom? I'm married to Middle Eastern Muslim man and I'm a black woman. Lots of my husbands Arab friends have interest in black women. They just don't know how to seek them.
Musleema,
While you are acknowledging that there are bad apples in every group you still seem to be suggesting that there are MORE bad apples to be found amoungst African-American brothers. Just because Arab or Asian sisters aren't getting divorced like AA sisters (and other women of color who marry AA bros) doesn't mean that they aren't enduring abuse or mistreatment. I have to go back to mommamu's point about the way divorce is viewed in America- we're not afraid to do it and brothers aren't afraid to grant it. Other women are just staying and putting up with all kinds of crap and then pretending everything is okay under the guise of "protecting their husband's honor". I've been in largely immigrant communities and I've been able to see the sides that outsiders don't normally get to see. It's ugly. I'm talking domestic abuse, infidelity, honor killings, etc. (Someone already mentioned those).
You say "Sisters of color chances of selecting a good, pious husband and have a harmonious marriage are better with brothers from other ethnicities." I'm disagreeing. It still seems you are in fact putting down AA bros and I have a problem with that. (Not to mention how you are captializing on exisiting stereotypes about AA bros). I don't think they are any worse or better than an Arab or Asian brother. They may have a different set of issues as they relate to cultural background and upbringing but they are not anymore prone to abuse or mistreatment than any other group of men. I think it's all about perspective.
I have been married to an Arab brother. There is a whole other set of issues and problems which come about when you're marrying cross culturally. We can go into them if you like. But I don't think it's as easy or as blissful as you're suggesting. And we won't even get into how utterly racist some non-Black brothers and sisters can be...
Yes, sisters need to be more vigilant in their efforts to find the right brother. They need to ask the right questions and give it some time. They also need to make use of istakhara. Perhaps part of the reason why you're finding so many "women of color" in bad situations (esp. revert sisters) is because we don't have the family and cultural connections to find out about a brother's family and background as Arab or Asian sisters may. And yes, there are AA bros who are doing wrong. There's no denying that. Some of them awful but a good number of them are wonderful brothers. (And they are not just exceptions).
The bottom line is, as I said, I don't think AA bros are any worse off. I just think their problems have been made public while other brothers get to keep their misbehavior quiet.
As-Salaamu Alaykum,
Sister Musleema thank you for your concern.
As a UK Afro-Caribbean Muslim brother, I said I would try to read your article with an open mind. This was due to the correct statement by Br AbdulHaqq Ashanti that these "constant blame on black brothers in the west" type posts have become quite frequent. Even though you didn’t use those words.
I also think sis mommamu made excellent points.
Although not at the same level as the Afro American revert population, London (especially South) has seen large numbers of Afro-Carib reverts to Islaam in the last 20 years – wal alhamdulilah. They have had their problems in marriages - yes, no doubt.
What I find strange is that in the Northern towns where the largest sections of our Pakistani community(what you guys call Desi) live e.g. Leeds, Bradford, Rochdale, Manchester etc. you find many instances of bad, bad marriages - including the associated problems that you highlighted. Many of these sisters would have used your selctions advice. This does not seem to be highlighted at the same level as the "problems of the AA(or in our case Afro-Carib(AC)". I know this as my friend is a counselor from the North. I also lived there.
Additionally, we have in the UK government a special section devoted to "forced marriages", which although not exclusively for the South Asian population does mainly cater for them.
I have another friend of Kashmiri origin who works in an organisation that aids women's projects that deal with domestic violence in Pakistan. Again we do not find many people writing blogs about this issue. You only have to look at the case of Mukhtai Mai in Pakistan and the issues it opened up to understand this.
The same goes for Saudi Arabia. Many people will be familiar with the case of Rania al-Baz (I do not think any relation the Shaykh -rahimuhuallah) the news-reader who was beaten by her violent husband. The issue opened up the issue of domestic violence in Saudi Arabia. Again no multiple articles on the "problems with S.Arabian brothers".
Does this detract from the fact that there are problems within the western brothers(AA,Latino and AC) - of course not. But, and I can't stop thinking sometimes that when I hear these things that there is a smattering of racism (not yourself Musleema, I am speaking from my experiences here). Because usually you hear these same people saying other things about UK blacks e.g. lazy, aggressive (especially those of us of Jamaican extraction), no akhlaq etc. And generally looking down on “dark skinned people” due to the skin colour not social issues.
It does leave one thinking “fair comment, I’ll take that one on the chin”, on the other hand I do also think “Hold on, that happens in your community as much, if not more than mine”
Also, Sis Musleema here in the UK the darker complexion is definitely looked down upon within the South Asian community – no doubt. And from personal experiences most of the Arab brothers prefer white, there is no way based upon my numerous conversations in the UK and the Arab world that they prefer black. The few I know married to Black women are the ones that grew up around us, ‘nyam’ jerk chicken(b4 marriage) and say “Waa Gwaan” after giving salaams.
It just makes me wonder if repeated posts about this issue do good or bad (you are of course, free to post whatever you feel like). I know everyone says “if we do not highlight it how will we change the situation”. These posts seem to trigger tribal feelings , and create an undercurrent of not just broadening your selection but actually, contrary to what you said, ‘x off’ certain racial groups – and do not do much to remedy the situation. You are part Guyanese, therefore I am sure you understand the existing tensions between Afro and Indian.
Sorry to go a bit off tangent, as I know you were focusing on selection.
Jazaki-allahu Khair
Ibn Zakariyya
Assalaamualaikum,
I think what you wrote, while intentioned to encourage Muslim women of color to be more vigilant in their search for a mate, is faulty. I can go on and on about all the strong AA marriages I know. But I can also talk about my non-AA Muslim friends I know who have strong marriages.
The point is that marriage is complicated. What goes on between two people is indeed complicated and it is often difficult to discern the specific reason while marriages don't work. I guess race is an easy way out of this problematic.
Much of what you wrote here is double-speak. You make generalizations based on race then say it's not about race. Sister, I ask you to please read about the divorce rate in Saudi Arabia and tell me if you still feel the same about specifically focusing on AA marriages??
I really find your argument indefensible. It is indefensible because you base this on your friends and your life. How does knowledge of your friends relationships then extend to a blog about AA brothers? It is really baffling to me. Each of us occupy such a small piece of the earth and our individual perspective of it is so very, very small. While I do not fault you for encouraging your friends to think bigger and beyond their own environments, or for raising questions, I think it is a real shame that you use it as an opportunity to make such gross generalizations. I find it very sad that AA American brothers are the whipping boys on so many of these Muslim blogs. It is really troubling...
You are absolutely right. It is my observation that while all nationalities of Muslims have their share of vices, AA and Latino brothers usually top out everyone else.
And I consider myself an insider. I grew up in a indo/pakistanian Muslim community and most of my friends are either indian or pakistanian sisters. And I am married to Arab. My first and only marriage. Been married almost a decade. I now live in middle east. I know what goes on in the immigrant communities, especially amongst the older generations where you will most likely see sisters anti divorce and more concerned about cultural norms than Islamic rights. That sort of antiquated idelogy is far less prevalent in second and third immigrant children.
Also I have seen a lot with my own eyes living in this Muslim country. No race of people are perfect and I'll say it again and again my intentions were not to praise any group. This is the dunya and it's full of tests. Everyone has problems today.
I acknowledge that now and I acknowledged it in the blog. We can talk forever about the ills other nationalities have which they do but that not going to change a single about that the fact that Musleemat of color are enduring more problems at the hands of their own men versus other brothers. And my observation has been it is because there are far more AA and Latino brothers who not prepared/fit/able to be husbands versus other other ethnicities of Muslim men. Who cares about that bad Muslim men of any nationality. This blog that I wrote was about sisters broadening their choices by selecting good, practicing Muslim men from other nationalities instead of taking chances from a limited pool of AA and Latino brothers doing what they're suppose to.
If sister would open up their options to brothers with better characteristics the dynamics of whole communities would change. Generations of Muslims would be stronger. Sisters have to take responsibility for their state.
We could place some blame on stranger marriages, but it's not everything. My friend Maleekah was raised Muslim, waited many years to wed and even used both of her parents assistance to find a mate. She was engaged for a year while she completed her last year of uni and still the AA brother didn't turn out to be any good for her. She's expecting, divorced and had to move in with her parents.
Her case isn't unique. This has been going on for years within AA Muslim communities. I know and have talked with AA and Latino sisters who became Muslims in the 60's and 70's and they have the same stories and say things have only become worse over the years.
And I agree cross cultural marriages have their own unique set of challenges. It's not for everyone, though manys sister could benefit from them. I think if you have two good Muslims who adhere to the Qur'an and sunnah first and committed to loving one another and they share some common interest it can be a wonderful experience. I have that with my husband. Alhamdulilah.
The blog was about selection, nothing else. If sisters know who and what type of brothers statistically dont do well in marriages inshallah I think they will make better selections. It is unfortunate to have to look at the numbers, but regardless of the all the reasons, the numbers don't lie.
Samira the blog wasn't about AA Muslim men, I blogged about my sisters broadening their pool of choices of GOOD Muslim men. And I am using my own life experiences and observations and the life experiences and observations of my AA, indian, pakistanian and arab sisters to go one. What else am I suppose to use?
I know very well about the atrocities in the Saudi and the gulf. I've seen many strange things in the lands of the Muslims. Many of times I've said, "atleast we aren't THAT bad back in the states!" and meant it whole heartedly. And Alhamdulilah I am able to read about the problems within Asian Muslim countries also. We have a lot of work to do all over this ummah. No one is free from ills.
Though Muslims I don't think theres is any reason to keep pointing those things out because I have not and did not suggest sisters to marry from ANY nationality if the brother is bad.
As I said in my blog deen and character are the most important things a sister looking to wed should concern herself with. Next should be his ability to be a good husband and father.
I do agree with Mommamu's points. There are numerous reasons for the situations within the AA, AC and Latino communities. That doesn't change the fact that our sisters dont have husbands or have husbands that are not fit to take care of them or their children. That doesn't change the fact that are sisters are being oppressed and abused. It doesn't change the fact that something needs to be done about our sisters state of affairs.
The blog was about selection, widening the choices as well as how to go about making an informed choice. And you know what, may be there is some double talk in the blog. I know there are wonderful AA, AC, and Latino Muslim men and I love them dearly for the good that they do for their families and their communities. I wrote that in the blog and I'm not going to deny it at any time if someone chooses to point it out or bring it up. Problem is there isn't enough of them to go around for all the sisters of color which leaves them 10 times more vulnerable to be matched up with the bad ones.
This blog seems to be another bullet against black people under the guise of giving marital advice to AA women.
I say we should continue to promote black female muslims to marry non-black men for at least a couple of generations to see what the results will be in the end.
It's not like this has not happened already and we don't have models to analyze.
For example, Oman, Somalia, Sudan, Morocco, Yemen have all experienced AA women married to non-black men. Unfortunately, those locations remain bastions of anti-africaness, which will be inevitable considering the battle for supremacy between racial groups. The children of these marriages will identify more with their desi or arab side than they will their African side.
As a happily married AA man I say allow AA women to have more options.
Unfortunately, these same men will not marry African women in their own countries. We all know the hard time African women have in Pakistan finding marriage, which is well documented. The cultural norms in Pakistan is totally anti-African, so we must hope that Westernized desi men have different values and attitudes than their parents regarding interracial relationships.
I have been around desi and arab people all my life and I know that they love AA women.
I say if AA women cannot see themselves with AA men, we as AA men should champion their cause for happiness.
AA women stay away from those jihadis and green card seekers with four wives and 10 concubines.
Salam
Unfortunately many sisters of all ethnicities are staying in bad marriages. I used to work full time at a local masjid and several have confided in me about their unhappiness. Note they are married to Arab, SE Asian, etc. men.
THe problem, in my opinion is we (as Muslim women) operate under the assumption that we must sacrifice our peace of mind and SAVE FACE, as the first poster mentioned. I did this in my first marriage as a Muslim. Prior to accepting Islam, I was marriage (one man since the age of 19, we stuck through the bad and hard times). Some Muslim men abuse their wives by threatening divorce.
As a convert we should not fear shy to include our nonMuslim brothers and fathers in the process. My current husband went to my nonMuslim father and asked his permission to marry me (I wouldn't have any other way, as I made teh mistake before assuming they could not be a part of this and it one I regret because I setttled for soemthing less (he wasn't black or latino) than I would have as a nonMuslim.
Sisters don't lower your standards and take your time, you deserve the best and he's worth the wait.
As salaamu alaikum,
As an African American man, who has ties to my family in Africa and who has traveled, I can agree what a lot of what you're saying. But the problem is not a problem specific to African and Latino men who are Muslim. Marital turmoil affects marriages in America period and of course where there’s widespread social issues that affects white society in America, it’s probably going to be seen to a greater extent in the black and Latino community.
Simply because a person comes to Islam, that doesn't mean that they have acquired a healthy social outlook and behavior pattern. So the problems that have faced the black and Latino communities have simply been transferred over the black and Latino Islamic communities.
So let's just look at facts and history. The Black community was actually a thriving community prior to integration. In black areas, there were black butcher shops, theaters, restaurants, libraries, masjids, churches, etc. It was healthy and families were in tact; the community had a healthy social structure. A white cop couldn't come into the black community and abuse a member of that neighborhood. It was hard for a white, Latino, or anyone of another race to marry a black person in those days because the community wouldn't really accept them.
So what happened you ask? Well, when black people started fighting for rights they were being denied, many of them turning militant, such as the "Nation of Islam", the black panthers, The FOI, and the like, the gov't decided that they couldn't handle a threat as serious as this inside it's own country. You must realize that black people are the only people who really have a legitimate excuse to fight against the gov't. of this country.
So after integration black people were duped into believing that if they joined and mixed with whites their life somehow would be better but that wasn't the case at all. The gov't. destroyed the black community by flooding the streets with a new found substance derived from cocaine....crack.
Crack being pushed upon blacks, now in financial trouble after abandoning their own business and commerce and not being hired by white society, were eager to make ends meet by selling drugs and by taking drugs to escape their own bleak existences. The affects of crack on black society took away fathers, sons, mothers, children, to the point where only a small percentage of African Americans today can say, they know no one in their families who hasn’t done drugs, even if it be a distant relative.
Understand, that this is not some lengthy justification for the apathy of the black community here in the states; I want non-blacks and especially immigrants, many of whom form a type of arrogance toward Black Americans, to get an understanding of "what the hell happened" to black America. Because many immigrants come to this country and think that black people were always this way, when that's far from the truth and in some instances they were forced out of prosperity.
With families being broken to such an extent, many black men AND WOMEN, non-Muslim and MUSLIM, have no example of how to be a man or woman; of how to run a household; when to let things go and when to address problems. No example of a hard work ethic etc.
This history being known and me being one who is African American, I say black people need to be responsible and step up being aware of the forces working against them.
So sister, insha Allah, I don't know if you meant to come across as if black (men) love being this way. They don't, just many of them don't know how to change themselves. I just advise you be careful when speaking socially of something like this because in order to know the cure you have to know what is causing the person to get sick. Otherwise, once you cut out the cancer, it will just grow right back. I believe people can marry who they want and sisters please do what you have to do in whatever is best for you and your life, insha Allah. But speaking in general, just having sisters run away to other races is not really a solution for the African American Muslim woman.
One thing I am a proponent of is African American women marrying AFRICAN men and African American men marrying AFRICAN WOMEN. Arabs, Indo-Paks, and the like are fine people but they aren't our people. Black America will never see light unless they reconnect with who they are and where they come from. This has been taken away from us.
So, I understand the intention behind your post and wanting the best for you sister, which, may Allah bless you, is the right way. But if you're going marry a man that is responsible, works hard, and is a good man, marry an African man or woman. You come from the same place and they will allow you to understand the wisdom of your history and legacy, which will restore pride and dignity in self.
Many Arab men will never even marry a black woman because it's stigmatized in most Arab communities. The same goes with indo-paks. So a lot of African American sisters are going to be setting themselves up for serious disappointment trying to go that route. Of course some do work out, but most don't.
Anyway, may Allah bless you and your family. As Salaamu alaikum.
After reading the posts, I have to respond with this also, I hardly think African American men are the worst in the world, although everyone has their shortcomings. AA men don't engage in honor killings, female circumcision, etc.
I just think that AA and Latino communities problems are more transparent because this society is an open one. But amongst other races women, in many instances, don't come out and just tell the world what's going on either because they can't or no one will listen. So let's just keep things real. The whole Ummah is on fire and only Allah can put it out.
Assalaam'Alaykum
1) Promoting victimization, endorsing the abdication of personal responsibility, and defining dysfunctional family systems as being "patented" by African Americans or Latin's is a miserable failure at offering solutions.
2) African American women who are adults are not victims in the demise of their marriages, families, well being, and quality of life. Apart of being an adult is taking care of yourself-apart of taking care of yourself is making responsible life decisions. Blaming external factors as the causes to your own failure is not going to ease the pain, frustration, and distress you're likely to experience from the consequences to making poor decisions. The method often utilized by the MAJORITY of Muslims concerning marriage is : haste-fullness, recklessness, and down right insanity. That is not uniquely a "African American" or a "Convert" problem, it is by and large, a "Muslim" problem. The truth and reality can be very difficult to accept so it's allot easier to blame and shame some one else instead. The real deal is that as humans we behave our way into or out of a situation. The real deal is that as humans we think the thoughts, we feel the feelings, and we make the choices into or out of a situation. The real deal is that red flags such as fraud, unemployment, mental illness, sexually transmitted diseases, fatherlessness, financial ruin, and spiritual emptiness were prevalent long before the marriage was ever finalized. The real deal is that many of us allow desperation, loneliness, isolation, libido and lust to drive us right into a crash called divorce.
3) The ethnic immigrant Muslim Community would do well to either put up or shut up. Put your money where your mouth is. Stop complaining, venting, slandering, and demoralizing African Americans as if were a monolithic group of people devoid of humanness. Require a higher caliber in the selection of Islamic clergy and Islamic leadership. Many Imams have no license and no training in marriage/family counseling, pastoral counseling, or social work. Many of the "African Americans" you're complaining about often sought intervention with their local Islamic clergy who often times offered nothing but clearly extremist, patriarchy, and distorted advice at alleviating the pain these families live with. The truth is that the deen is being used as a weapon that just serves to reinforce any pathology/ dysfunction already occurring within these families units. What a sorry and pathetic state of affairs becuase the spirit of Islam should be a vehicle to success and healthiness. Instead it is a passport to drudgery, poverty, illiteracy, abuse, and instability for many of the people you are complaining about. The Department of Social Services See's it but becuase they half to remain political correct or neutral becuase religion is involved they can't come out and say it directly. But you better best believe it's a strong undercurrent to how they serve THE ENITRE Muslim community.
4) The ethnic immigrant Muslim Community has failed miserably in their out reach to middle class and upper middle class African Americans. This population of African Americans is where you are most likely to find stable families becuase marital/familial stability is directly tied to economic stability. Multiple marriages and abandoned children would be scoffed at in many circles of the black elite, but then again, the immigrant Muslims are unaware of this becuase they are sitting toe to toe with the likes of Colin Powell or some one similar in stature. As a revert, I've never seen such brokenness in families until converting to Islam. I've been to Bishop T.D. Jake's church/congregations, and similar religious organizations. I've seen nothing but legions of strong, and stable Black men and black families. Bishop T.D. Jake's has succeeded in what the best Imams in the Muslim community can't do. They can't even touch the magnitude of his success.
5) I'm not perfect. I'm not going to sit behind some computer screen blogging away at how righteous I am becuase of my ethnic group, language, or my perceived adherence to Islam. Allah is the best of judges and the best of planners. With that being said, I can't leave this article in good conscience with out saying that Allah has granted all of mankind an internal radar system that sends each and everyone of us warning messages when were about to make a foolish, reckless, insane decision. Many of choose to disregard those warning signs to drive straight through a red light, and than cry foul when we crash. We cry foul when we can't handle the consequences. Many of chose to disregard those warning signs becuase a) undiagnosed/untreated mental illness b) misguided notions of Islam c) low self-esteem or d) which is the saddest of all, we gave up on ourselves and our children. We abandoned hope in exchange for fatalism. The truth hurts and many don't want to hear it but I believe it's their problem not mine.
6) The majority of Sunni mainstream African American Muslim women have been taught they are prohibited from marrying non-Muslim men. I think this should be re-examined and that African American Muslim women may fair so much better if they didn't have their options limited by everybody else. I've met nothing but dynamic, exceptional African American Men while attending Bishop T.D. Jakes congregation and others like it. I'm not buying this myth they don't exist at all.
And for the record, I'm an African America Muslima married to a African brother.
Wa alaikum as salaam
Well said Tabari! I'm glad I am not the only one who realizes "The Black community was actually a thriving community prior to integration."
There are wonderful black american men and women in this country who do not fit the narrowminded stereotype projected via the media. In fact the majority of black Americans DO NOT fit the stereotype as with Muslims.
As Salaamu Alaikum,
Did you folks watch "Roots" the 2nd Generation recently? Islam is not a sunday church hookup. Today's Islam is a way of life the encompasses a sophisticted spiritual, historical, social, economic, political, cultural dynamics for 21st Century life. By large, the African American baton of Islam has only been pass down through one or two generations. It was Al Hajj Malik Shabazz and the Muslim American Communities that force the doors , fought the wars to open the floodgates of Islam in American and made it paletable for all decent muslims who come to America do their "thing", wear their veils, jibabs etc. We did it when it was extremely unpopular in the West. Brothers and sisters from the East etc. were incognito, trying to blend in to "look, dress and act white" during those crucial years of the MSA, 60's, 70's. The general muslim world in America is riding off of our coat tails, struggles of indigenous mulims and acting like they made some groundbreaking advancements in America. Point and case, the latest Islamic Horizons claims of being 1st at chaplaincy.matson and her group are the are Johnny, Ya Ya, Come Lately.
The A.A. Muslim community has been riddled with inner city poverty, poor education, and the lack of inheritance of wealth and property that has been afforded by their fellow muslim counterparts.
Still, yet we rise, in this temporal world to the real home in the Hereafter.Surely, man was created for toil and struggle and the real home is in the Hereafter.
Yes, the selection process of mates of the African American muslim women especially the mature , experienced through life have a microcosim of African American muslim mates to choose from. Our sisters are by far well educated, and steadfast spiritually in the deen. As AA muslim sisters, as we branch out to find our mates, we have to do our homework like we do on the job or at the university, do the research. I pray that sisters find their maritial dignity, and that any such muslim brother is worthy of your noblility.
Mubruk!,
Umm.A.S.
I am really surprised by the response to your posts. I think all you are saying is that Muslim women of color we need to have respect for ourselves and higher standards and stop limiting ourselves to Black men if these men will not respect you, provide for you and your children.
I saw this post and it seems to echo what you wrote here.
http://bfinterracialmarriage.blogspot.com/index.html
im really sick of the way reverts feel the constant need to put down south asians. why do you have to pick on us all the time?? whenever there you mention something negative about the muslim community you have to refer to pakistanis or indians. how come you never have anything positive to say about our people, im really sick of your racist attitudes you bring from you jahiliyah days.
Wow a south asian is tired of reverts racism. That is funny coming from a people who invented the caste system. Racism is a system, so which system is implemented by reverts against desis? Are the reverts lying about south asians? The execellent points they made were that Black pathologies are well known while other groups pathologies are hidden. Example the lack of education of Blacks in America versus well educated Indians. While back in India there are 200-300 million low caste Indians who are illiterate. Millions of low caste Indians who eat rats. Millions of child prostitutes. I could go on but you get the point. America cherry picks talented immigrants and it gives the impression that the rest of the country is loaded with the same caliber of people.
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